Republican proposal: Double the deficits!


What’s worse that “double or nothing?”

Republican tax-cut proposals would double our deficits, some conservative sources report.

Robert Schesinger, in U.S. News and World Report:

In fact the GOP’s deficit-detonating tax-cut proposals make the Democrats with their spending look like pikers. The stimulus bill, remember, cost $787 billion. The tax-cut bill that Senate GOP Leader Mitch McConnell unveiled last week—a combination of making permanent the Bush tax cuts and throwing in a host of other tax credits—has a price tag of around $3.9 trillion. For those keeping score at home, the self-styled party of fiscal responsibility wants to blow a hole in the budget nearly five times larger than the alleged profligacy they have spent the last year or more condemning.

Who is listening to the facts anymore?

19 Responses to Republican proposal: Double the deficits!

  1. Jim Stanley says:

    Yes, good point Ed. They paid a rate of 91%.

    Oh, and your remark about invading Russia before the snows set in? Well done! (Though I note with no little amount of amusement, the Bohemian Corporal actually had real-world military experience. The Decider, not so much.)

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  2. Ed Darrell says:

    I think we need to clear up some stuff: The highest tax rate at one time was about 90%, for the super, super rich, at one time.

    They did not pay 90% of the taxes then, however — nor ever.

    Ed

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  3. Nick K says:

    Ellie writes:
    But, but, if he had succeeded, just think how many of us would have starved to death and decreased the surplus population!

    Well I did say the Republican motto seems to be “Only the fittest survive in this world. If you’re rich you live if you’re not you die.”

    And for all their terror and paranoia about “socialism” or rather “Communism” which is what they really mean..they sure do seem to miss Marx’s point that what he predicted would occur not because the poor or the middle class wanted it…but because the excesses of the rich and powerful would cause it.

    Oh and before any on the other side open their mouths…we’re a million miles from actual socialism or actual communism. But if we cross that line ever it will be because of your side. Principally your sides inability to recognize the necessity for balance when it comes the economic situation of the country and its people.

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  4. Ellie says:

    But, but, if he had succeeded, just think how many of us would have starved to death and decreased the surplus population!

    Like

  5. Ed Darrell says:

    His [Bush’s] greatest failure, according to him, was his failure to privatize Social Security.

    And his second greatest failure was not invading Russia, across Poland, on June 18, to ensure a quick victory drive before the snows set in?

    The mind just boggles.

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  6. Nick K says:

    So those who are of the political right on this blog can’t bother to answer a simple question.

    If the rich paid 90% in taxes at the time of Eisenhower’s Presdiency but they pay less then half that rate now…when have we cut their taxes enough?

    The silence is deafening.

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  7. Nick K says:

    Ed, Jim, did you hear that W said what his greatest failure was yesterday?

    His greatest failure, according to him, was his failure to privatize Social Security.

    Yep, that’s right…he thinks his greatest failure wasn’t him preventing the mass murder of 3000 people in New York City…but his failure to screw over the middle class by destroying social security.

    Oh and before anyone is stupid enough to argue that last point…this whole idea of “privatizing Social Security” hinges on the idea that people should invest that money in the stock market.

    Tell me…what did the stock market do during Bush’s presidency? Oh that’s right…it crashed.

    Just another scheme the Republicans cooked up to make the rich richer and leave everyone else out in the streets.

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  8. Nick K says:

    Oh and here’s another fact for you, geo, and you, Barton, as of 2005 the largest US companies evaded over 100 billion dollars in taxes. And yet curiously..the party of “personal responsibility” and “tough on crime”…i.e. the Republicans..didn’t go after them and has in fact sheltered them for their crimes.

    The argument that these companies are doing so because of high taxes, high regulation and high wages would result in the American people being paid mere dollars for a days work, having US companies doing as they please even if it harms people and have the country have the economic infrastructure of Somalia.

    SO tell us, Barton and Geo..which are you more loyal to? The United States? Or the Republican party and their paying masters?

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  9. Jim Stanley says:

    I love how people keep bringing up Greece and Spain as examples of countries on the brink of economic collapse because of supposed Socialism.

    These countries have modest business and individual tax rates. And they, Greece in particular, have a culture in which tax evasion is almost considered a game any decent Greek plays. No wonder they are in freefall. The government doesn’t collect the taxes it’s owed and yet it continues to provide the services people expect.

    It’s not all that different here in the states, except our federal tax rates are absurdly low. Read Robert Reich’s book.

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  10. Ed Darrell says:

    And, irony of ironies, we did all this at home — and still managed to rebuild Japan and Europe after the devastation of the Second World War.

    Theologically, I beleive this is because God blesses societies that make the poor and the stranger a priority. But never mind — I concede that not everyone is interested in matters religious.

    Logically, it is proven and demonstrable. Robert Reich is right. President Obama is being much too timid. And the Republicans are wholly defending the “gospel” of Ayn Rand. If they win, American loses. It has never been more starkly simple.

    Amen.

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  11. Ed Darrell says:

    39% of our population essentially pays no Federal income taxes at all. Hint, that’s not the rich.

    Got a source? I think you’re missing the point.

    Most Americans living below the poverty line paid more taxes in some recent years than Exxon-Mobil paid. Don’t ask me to weep for the company making the largest profits on Earth, ever.

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  12. Nick K says:

    I wrote:
    Meaning no more health care insurance companies deciding that oops..that kid who develops cancer…well they can’t kick him off insurance.

    Obviously that should be “Meaning no more health care insurance companies deciding that oops..since that kid developed cancer..well we’re going to kick him off insurance.”

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  13. Nick K says:

    Oh I forgot one other thing. Your side also agrees to the United vs decision gets tossed out the window and burned.

    Like

  14. Nick K says:

    Geoman writes:
    39% of our population essentially pays no Federal income taxes at all. Hint, that’s not the rich. Back in Ike’s time the rich paid 90%, the poor 20%. Now we have the rich paying 40% and the poor paying nothing.

    39% of the population essentially pays no federal income taxes at all BECAUSE THEY’RE TOO POOR TO. Plus you’re rather blithely forgetting they still pay other taxes. See..its real easy to gin that “40% of the country pays no federal income taxes” up as a problem when doesn’t bother with the details of why they don’t.

    You said the rich paid 90% taxes in Ike’s time. Ok…they’re taxes are at best half that rate now. Tell me, at what point have we cut their taxes enough?

    Geoman writes:
    Nick K – keep on believin’! And why do companies GO offshore anyway, to foreign countries, with currency issues, less stability, higher transportation costs, and language problems? Oh…right. Unions, taxes and red tape in the U.S. But by all means, let’s close those loopholes.

    Oh yeah..lets get rid of Unions, taxes and red tape. That will bring the jobs back. Of course it will also turn the United States into a third world country. If unions were at this point as powerful as you and your fellows on the right think…no company could get away with moving jobs overseas. But no…Messiah Reagan and the Republicans did a very good job of destroying the unions, their power and making damn sure that the federal labor laws weren’t enforced so the companies…or rather their owners could get filthy rich, not have to pay a dime, destroy US jobs and move those jobs overseas where they can get away with paying a dollar a day. As for red tape..tell me…you don’t mind if the Koch brothers dump pollution in your back yard right?

    Your precious Republicans cut taxes for the last decade, supposedly cut red tape and let companies get away with everything short of murder. Oh wait..they did let companies get away with murder. And did that help the economy? No. They crashed the economy.

    As for stopping outsourcing..gee a way to help halt that is to set up a tax structure where companies that outsource pay exorbiantly higher taxes then companies that don’t.

    Geoman writes:
    I wonder – have you watched the news lately, as the French, English, Greeks, Irish…etc. face economic collapse? Countries and economies around the world are not on the verge of collapse because they are doing too little for the poor…or not taxing anyone enough. There seems to be some other problem. Something to do with spending more than they can possibly afford….I dunno. It is all so mysterious…

    And none of those economies are the size of the United States. Do you honestly think that those countries would be having the problems they’re having if the world’s economy hadn’t nearly crashed? But if you’re so worried about spending..tell me..where were you when the Republicans ran up the defecit? Where were you when the Republicans were spending money like shopaholics in the worlds largest mall? Where were you when the Republicans spent trillions of dollars on a war they should have fought but ****** up (Afghanistan) and spent even more trillions of dollars on a war that shouldn’t have been fought at all. (Iraq) Hm?

    Where were you when the Republicans spent money giving massive tax cuts to the richest 10% of the country rather? Or did you somehow forget that in accounting that’s actually counted as an expense? Oh that’s right…you and your fellow Republicans were nowhere to be seen because you were following Cheney’s “Defecit’s don’t matter.” Of course the second a Democrat gets in the White House you’re suddenly defecit/budget hawks.

    As for your deal..you want spending at Bush’s level? That would actually increase spending. But tell you what. I’ll make a counteroffer. We’ll set taxes at the level they were at the end of Clinton’s term in office. And we’ll cut spending. Starting with the tax cuts to the rich, the Iraq war, all those contracts that Bush and company gave to their cronies and also all the corporate welfare that your side just loves to dish out. Oh and you agree that the military budget gets cut. Or weren’t you aware that we spend more on our military then the next 18 countries combined. And that if we halved our military we’d still have more then the next 8 countries combined. 45% of the money we spend is on our military…and that’s not counting the two wars.

    But the financial reforms stay. Health care reform stays. The tax cuts to the middle class stays. And you agree that if any company or industry doesn’t act ethically and morally and for the betterment of the country we get to regulate them up one side and down the other. Meaning no more health care insurance companies deciding that oops..that kid who develops cancer…well they can’t kick him off insurance. No more Massey Energy sacrificing their worker’s safety so they can’t make a bit more money and pay their CEO a bigger salary. No more KBR/Halliburton throwing a woman inside a cargo crate to keep her from reporting that she got gangraped by some of her fellow employees. No more Blackwater CEO smuggling illegal arms into Iraq..and also hookers on his private jet. No more BP letting 11 of its employees die because they couldn’t be bothered to maintain their oil rig properly. No more the richest increasing their wealth 300% in 30 years while the middle class remains stagnant.

    Because sorry, Geo, it was your party that ran the country into the ground. So since your party just loves talking about “personal responsibility” your party will take personal responsibility for the mess you got us in.

    Let me know when you want to worry about your economic self interest rather then the economic self interest of the Koch brothers and their cronies.

    And then you can answer this one simple question. If the people aren’t spending and if the private sector isn’t spending…exactly how do you think the economy is going to get a jump start and start growing again…if the government doesn’t?

    Because its real easy for your party to start talking about the need for sacrifice. But I find it real curious that your party thinks that the middle class should do all the sacrificing while the rich not only aren’t expected to sacrifice…but get protected from the very idea. Your party wants to get rid of Social security, medicare, the VA, the minimum wage.
    Let me know when you and your party want to bother worrying about the middle class instead of selling your souls to those who already live like kings. Hell..better then kings.

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  15. geoman says:

    Pretty funny stuff.

    I’m interested – exactly what facts are you taking into account here? Numerous Democrats (including Obama) were all for extending various forms of the Bush tax cuts as well. But they are just doing it because…well what fact based reality driven reason are they proposing those things?

    Nick K – keep on believin’! And why do companies GO offshore anyway, to foreign countries, with currency issues, less stability, higher transportation costs, and language problems? Oh…right. Unions, taxes and red tape in the U.S. But by all means, let’s close those loopholes. That’ll show ’em.

    39% of our population essentially pays no Federal income taxes at all. Hint, that’s not the rich. Back in Ike’s time the rich paid 90%, the poor 20%. Now we have the rich paying 40% and the poor paying nothing.

    I wonder – have you watched the news lately, as the French, English, Greeks, Irish…etc. face economic collapse? Countries and economies around the world are not on the verge of collapse because they are doing too little for the poor…or not taxing anyone enough. There seems to be some other problem. Something to do with spending more than they can possibly afford….I dunno. It is all so mysterious…

    I’ll make a dealeo with you guys – we can let the Bush tax cuts expire, as long as we go back to Bush spending levels.

    Like

  16. Jim Stanley says:

    A solid economic stimulus plan would put money in the hands of people who SPEND that money…not people who offshore their money to avoid paying taxes.

    What Robert Reich is saying in his newest book is prophetically powerful and, though it was certainly not his intention, Biblical.

    When the poor are helped, countries prosper. When the gap between the wealthy and poor shrinks, nations prosper. (Jer. 22)

    Reich, of course, draw from history and not theology for his paradigm…as is most apt in our secular republic. Reich makes an inarguable, indisputable point: The United States was never more prosperous or financially muscular than in the years from the 1940’s up to about 1980. This was never more true than during the administration of Republican President Dwight Eisenhower.

    The tax rate on the fabulously wealthy was 91%. It is now in the 40’s. Yet these wealthy prospered in the 50’s. And their less wealthy neighbors prospered, too. During this time, we built an interstate highway system that was the envy of the world. We improved and build new airports and rail infrastructure. We built more schools and hospitals than at any time in our history. And ALL the people — from the wealthiest to the poorest — were taken care of.

    And, irony of ironies, we did all this at home — and still managed to rebuild Japan and Europe after the devastation of the Second World War.

    Theologically, I beleive this is because God blesses societies that make the poor and the stranger a priority. But never mind — I concede that not everyone is interested in matters religious.

    Logically, it is proven and demonstrable. Robert Reich is right. President Obama is being much too timid. And the Republicans are wholly defending the “gospel” of Ayn Rand. If they win, American loses. It has never been more starkly simple.

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  17. Nick K says:

    Just like how the Republicans protected the tax loopholes that US companies use to save money off shipping jobs overseas.

    Yeah that’s right, Barton, your party protects the tax loopholes of companies that send your job overseas.

    The Republican party is the bought and paid for whore of big money and big companies. They simply and bluntly don’t give a damn about you or the rest of us.

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  18. Nick K says:

    No, Barton, we are listening to the facts. You and your fellow Republicans aren’t.

    That 4 trillion price tag that US News and World Report….that comes originally from the Congressional Budget Office.

    If Bush’s tax cuts really didn’t add to the defecit..then pray tell why did the defecit rise to heights not seen since Reagan after they were enacted?

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  19. Apparently you aren’t.

    Like

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